Samee’s story of how he found himself in a situation without a home.
We follow Samee’s journey of courage and strength.
Samee’s story of how he found himself in a situation without a home.
We follow Samee’s journey of courage and strength.
Imagine being homelessness country, that actually isn't your home country that you're not familiar with at all. Down to, you're not actually even familiar with the climate of said country and being in your early twenties, which was the age Samee was out when he's going to tell his story, or now he's in his thirties, but at the time he was in his twenties, when he went through what he went through. Samee, firstly, thank you for doing this. And can you tell me one why you wanted to do this and just tell me a bit about you. Who are you, how would you describe you?
Samee:Okay. First of all, thank you so much for inviting me to this podcast. The reason, the core reason why I wanted to do this podcast with you is to give a new perspective to people who haven't gone through homelessness for them to know what is the experience of a person is when they have to go through that. So as for background. I wasn't born in here. I was born in Pakistan. I came in here in 2009. Now I've got two beautiful daughters. a lovely wife I've got my parents in, here, my siblings in here. And I've worked for a housing association, which is quite ironic after being homeless.
Adeola:A quick, just a quick thing, went onto Google and was trying to do some research and it popped up, one of the things that came up, and this is actually what it said was the main cause of homelessness is largely due to mental illness, substance abuse, and the decreasing amount of affordable housing. Can you agree with any of those, three? Just wanted to mention that. These were obviously only some factors. There by no means all of them. And when Samee I did this, it was in 2019 shelter estimated that there was 280,000 homeless people, including those in temporary accommodation at the end of December, 2019 also, if you're found rough sleeping, you can actually be arrested and deported for that. You can actually be deported. And I suspect obviously that the number of rough sleepers number of homeless people has increased since 2019 and possibly rather than taking certain steps such as deportation. Maybe we should be looking into what we can do to help them. So there are charities out there. Crises, shelter. That can assist that, you can donate money to, there's an increased amount of people now who are using food banks, including people with young children, babies, elderly people, you can find them in your local supermarket. So the housing situation has changed since 2019 so i just wanted to add that in.
Samee:I think the first two mental health crisis and addictions, I think they are exceptions. They're not general rules, but I think the third one, the lack of affordable rent, that's a big problem. That's a massive issue. And I think that that's the main reason why people fall out of the ladder and then they fall into homelessness
Adeola:I agree with that because I think in my situation, for example, it only takes for me to not get three paychecks paid into my bank account. You know what I mean? And actually from that point on I'm, at risk of losing my home. So I guess, Yeah, I agree with you. You can't really just, create those three categories and say, that's it, I do think is a lot more complicated than that, but you do agree with the decreasing amount of affordable housing.
Samee:That's true. Yes. That's one of the peronally I went through that so I can say yes. And the people I, I was staying with in the, in one of the hostels where a lot of homeless families were. That's one of the core issues lack of affordable rent.
Adeola:Okay. What do you be able to just briefly explain how you went from you got here in 2009. So how you went from 2009 to basically the point where you found yourself with no way to live, what factors contributed to that?
Samee:Yeah. So when I first arrived in this country back in 2009 with my family, because one of the conditions for our visas was that we cannot access any of the public funds, which means you cannot get housing benefit, everything that you do comes out of your pocket. And that includes the rent. So we sit in a private property for a few years.
Adeola:People think that when immigrants come over, they literally just walk off, you know, walk out of the train station or a taxi and then walk into, the benefit office. And then they're given however, much money. I do think it's a myth that people think, oh yeah. You know, they just come over and they just given money straight away. So thank you for saying that's not the case Samee, please continue.
Samee:Yes. So this is a general perception in this country, that immigrants, they just land and they get everything. When the reality is completely opposite, you're not getting anything. And on top of that, you have to pay all of the taxes that are due on your wages that you earn. So you're not getting anything, but you're paying the government. And if you miss out on it, then it doesn't matter. How many years you spent in this country. How much do you have invested in here you'll be sent back.
Adeola:So if you're an immigrant and you have to go and private rent, and then you have to wait before you can even apply for social housing, you still have to pay taxes, make it make sense, government. That makes no sense at all.
Samee:Exactly. Yeah. So you've got to pay all of the taxes is, but you can't get anything back. And it's not just the benefits. a person, a young kid like me came in here. I cannot access any of the colleges or universities until I pay oversee student fee, which is much more higher than what a national citizen of this country pays. So I think it's very unfair and that's one of the reasons when immigrants come in this country, they do not get equal opportunities and they can fall back. Like someone like me who would ideally be doing a white collar job. Is now stuck with a blue collar job. I mean, im not saying it's a bad thing, but what I'm saying is I could have done much more better.
Adeola:Okay. So there could be people who could possibly say that. Well, I hate saying it because I think it's, so it just, I find it so offensive. If you're going to come over here and complain and you think you could do better, then why don't you go back home?
Samee:No no, that's a fair question. And let me clarify. I'm very happy to be here. It was a very good decision that we came here. That's not a problem. What I'm saying is I'm not complaining that I didn't get this, so I'm not blaming anyone. But I'm saying is that there's certain rules that can be changed for skilled immigrants who are coming here who basically helping look your country or our country. And they, they invested I accept that this is my country but make things easy for people who are coming here, people that you need to come here and serve you in NHS and other places. So make it easy for them. And I'm not saying that you have to change all of the laws, some of the laws, some of the rules by home office, they don't, they do not make sense and they should be changed.
Adeola:Okay. I agree. that people who don't get access to anything should not be then paying taxes, but again, United Kingdom. They just tax you tax you tax you, tax you throughout your life and you, when you die. So I'm not overly surprised at all.
Samee:Going back to the private property bit, the reason why I went into this spiral of, in this procedure of getting myself out on the streets, is the way it all started is that because we were paying private rent, and it was two bedroom house. If I needed more, because I got married, I got a kid now and the council said, this is overcrowded property. You got to move out. We couldn't do this because going to a three bedroom house and paying more rent, we could not afford. So I basically went back to council and I said, look, I've got my family, I've got my parents and my siblings. They can stay in this house, but can you provide me with a residence? And they agreed to it to, to their credit, they agreed to it. And they put me in a homeless hostel. For a few months.
Adeola:Who was that? Was that just
Samee:my wife and me, me and my kid.
Adeola:Because by this time, by this time, cause I don't know if you've said it by this time. How many years later we're looking at from 2009 to when?
Samee:four years later. So in 2014,2014, when my first baby was born.
Adeola:Okay. I'm calculating. in my little brain So years later in that time you got married and you had a baby.
Samee:Yes
Adeola:Another question and you know what this one's going to be.
Samee:I know.
Adeola:Okay. But why did you think, knowing your situation, your housing situation, did you not think that actually, do you know what really, it's not such a sensible idea to get married at this time and have a baby because we're going to be overcrowded because prior to this stage, you already had five people in a two bed and then you're looking at six people and a baby in a two bed.
Samee:Yeah, no, that's a fair question. But, first of all, my naivety, I didn't know that what the rules and laws are that if you've got a kid, if you've got a baby and you got all these people living in, in one property, that's overcrowdedness, you've got to move out. I didn't know these laws, I'm not from here. So I have no clue where we're from in our culture. We stay our parents regardless of how many kids you have that's how things roll. So put my hand up.
Adeola:Okay. Okay, fine. I'm going to agree with you on that one then, because I was going to say you should have done your research. There's no way I'd go to a foreign country, and not do not do my research, but it's fine. I get it. You were young. I'm basically saying you were young.
Samee:I mean you can move somewhere, but you're not going to know all of the laws. I still don't know. A lot of the stuff, even though I've been here, 12 years, I don't know everything. Cause I'm not from here,
Adeola:But you don't need to know everything, but you should surely know the things that you need, I don't know all the laws, but I know things that apply to me for example, you know?
Samee:Yeah, yeah. But again, I never thought about it. And the second thing. Is that if you mean like my circumstances should get better before I have kids. And that's, that's, that's a very good idea. But in real life, I think even now you can say your circumstances arent good enough for two kids or three kids, but you can't hold your life back because your circumstances are not good. I can't be saying I'm not going to have kids until I have my own property, ideally, that's not going to happen.
Adeola:Okay. Fair enough. Fair enough. Okay. So you went to the council. So they put you in a hostel you and your wife and the baby.
Samee:Yes and the baby
Adeola:Okay. So then what, happened from there?
Samee:yeah, so I was in that hostel with my family. There's kep keeping in mind that it's just a single bedroom. I'm not talking about a flat, so, Is it communal is there a kitchen? bath facilities, toilet, how big would you say, how big would you say it was?
Adeola:What was it? Was it like, I don't know, in my head it's because I know that I had to go into one. but that's a whole other story. Not like check myself into one. I had to go into one anyhoo. but it was a house. But it was, divided into different rooms. Was it like that?
Samee:No. So it's, it was a hostel, but it was previously an old care home
Adeola:Right, okay.
Samee:And they've, they've transformed that into a homeless base or homeless hostel
Adeola:Okay
Samee:And it's they got everything communal. So you have to share kitchen, you have to share baths. You have to share toilets. And then you have your own individual bedrooms. There's a single bed. It's not like you've got a flat and then you go two bedrooms. So I was in there for a year and then I was offered a property, which was coincidentally right next to where I'm living right now, funnily enough. And I was offered that property for my family to move in. It was a one bedroom flat.
Adeola:Okay
Samee:But we went there for viewing and that's where things get really, really messed up. We went there for a viewing and we were told that if you don't like this property, that basically you can say no. So we went inside, we saw mould, a lot of mould, some leakage, stuff like that. And we went back to council and I said that my wife has got severe asthma and I've got mild asthma and I've got young kids. I cannot be staying in a property. Where there's a leak there's mould. I'm not talking about small mould. I'm talking about whole portion of wall basically covered in mould And at that point, council came back to me and they said, because you're saying no to this property. That means you've made yourself homeless intentionally
Adeola:yeah. Intentionally homeless. I don't know about all boroughs, but I know where a particular borough that has the same policy. That if you, if they show you around somewhere and you say, no, I don't want it. Then they'll say, okay, you've made yourself intentionally homeless. and some of the reasons that I've seen people say they don't want properties has varied from. Well, my stepfather who had sexually molested me, lives around the corner. and I, dont understand was that and how you would not then want to put that person back on the list, but that person was told no, you've made yourself intentionally, homeless by saying no, loads of reasons. And I don't know, it's just. Okay. So do you kind of, I know what you're going to say and know what your response is going to be, but do you kind of see why councils would say to people, you get one offer. If you're homeless, you get one offer and that's it. Do you understand why they say that?
Samee:Yes, but they didn't inform us. And that's another problem that I've faced with them is that you didn't inform us. if I knew I'd be like, I don't care. What's in that flat. So I went back to council and I said, look, if you're saying this are more than happy to move in there. And they came back to me and said, too, late, you have to move out. That was a shock and yeah.
Adeola:So not only you didn't take that property and then it had gone on, but they also wanted you to move out the property that you were currently in
Samee:yeah. So the hostel that I was living in, they gave me ultimatum and they said, by the end of this week, you should be out. And I asked them, where am I supposed to go? And they said, that's not our problem. That's your problem. And by the end of the week, I was ready to go. And there was police officers. There was, Sheriff's, whatever their called.
Adeola:Samee, you know what I was literally listening? And I was feeling all like, oh, this is so emotional.
Samee:do you know how sheriffs have you seen dont pay we'll take away, they not called sheriffs what they call then?
Adeola:They called. Bailiff's not sheriffs. Just wanted to say I'm sorry. I know. It's not even funny. It's just when you said sheriffs. I was like what Sheriff's I'm so confused, but know that they definitely called bailiff's.
Samee:I just mixed it up.
Adeola:There was bailiffs or sheriffs as Samee calls them.
Samee:I'm not wrong.
Adeola:No, no, theres ballifs. So Samee, you just wanted to say that English, isn't his first language, which is one that he uses quite frequently when he allegedly doesn't understand. But do you know why your getting confused Samee? Because sheriff is American in America they have sherrifs.
Samee:Yes. And I learned American English back home. So there you go.
Adeola:You were taught the words. Okay. We need to move on from this word, sheriff. Okay.
Samee:The point I was trying to make is
Adeola:Alot of people, Alot of people turned up. How did that feel? What did that feel like? That? standing there your wife and the baby, with all these people, when you didn't commit a crime, you didn't say you weren't going, what did that feel like? What did, how did you feel like you were treated? Because to me, I would say. I don't know, I would have just felt like I was being treated like basically, like I had done something wrong. True. And I asked him, I said, is there a reason, is there a crime being committed for you being here that I'm getting a evicted that doesn't make sense that you are here?
Samee:And they all said that I go from police officers, that they are there for to make sure there's no breach of peace I said back to him that you being here is basically rubbing me off in a wrong way. So your causing breach of peace, but anyhoo? I didn't make a fuss. I just picked my stuff up and I left. And the funny, the coincidence when I was getting evicted from the hostel my parents are back home, the locked, everything up when they went back home. So I'm going to go. Yes, I could have gone, but I couldn't. And then my in-laws were in Coventry and I couldn't go to outside London because my job was here. So we were like on the streets and thank God for Shelter. We rang them up and we explained that we were going through this and on, our behalf, they spoke to council and they got us. A hotel room for a couple of nights. And they basically said that, look, it's only for a couple of nights afterwards. Basically you are on your own. That's the best we can do. So those two nights we stayed in a hotel. And the third night we spent in a police station with my kids on the floor.
Adeola:How did that happen?
Samee:Right. So after two nights in the hotel, which was paid back by the council, thanks to Shelter, they make, they made them do this. And after the second night we had no way to go. So my wife and me, along with our kids, we went to police station and we were like, look, we've got nowhere to go. Can you help us? And police said that we are police force. We don't get involved anything to do with social services. So we can't help you. So we said, the least you can do is because it's a 24 hour police station can just allow us to be here for the night. And they said, yes, you can do it. So thanks to them that one night we spent there, that's what we did.
Adeola:Where did you sleep?
Samee:Slept in police station station, on the floor
Adeola:right okay no as in i meant. Like you didn't sleep in, I don't know, like in a cell or
Samee:no, no, no, no. They basically said it's a reception, so, and we are open 24 hours. So if you want to stay here, you're more welcome
Adeola:you slept in a police reception.
Samee:Yes. With my wife and kids.
Adeola:What was that like?
Samee:It was okay. What can I do?
Adeola:What did that feel? What was that experience? Leaving the hostel to being met by police, a bailiff or if you're Samee a sheriff.
Samee:Sheriff
Adeola:so then being yes fine and then you put up in the hotel for only two nights and then.
Samee:Yes. So let me explain this to you like this. Do you know how it feels like it feels like you are alone in this whole universe. Like people are going around, you doing their business and they living their life and you they're like you're homeless. You've got nowhere to go. Nowhere to hide. If it's raining, if there's a storm outside you basically on your own. And is that the first time I've felt like I'm alone nobody for me in this whole universe, that's what it, felt, like is such a hopeless feeling. I've never felt like that before, and I've never felt like that again, but that night was something else. Yeah. Hopeless.
Adeola:How was your wife holding up? We have all of this going on.
Samee:we were numb. We were a numb, my kids were crying. Cause we stayed outside the whole day. It's quite cold. This was just after Christmas.
Adeola:Sorry, just to mention this time you've had another child.
Samee:Yes. Yes. So two kids by then, the second daughter was born whilst we were in the hostel
Adeola:okay. No, it's just because you keep saying kids, but we didn't say that you had another, you had another child, thats why.
Samee:Yeah. So I have another child whilst I was in the hostel. So I had two kids with me and they were crying. They vomited, we had no nowhere to clean their clothes. So it was like that. And yet that image is going to stay with me, for the rest of my life. For good. Like, it pushes me, motivates me to do better everyday. And make sure that doesn't happen. Cause I, I partially blame myself, for, what I put my family through, even though they don't blame me, I blame myself. So yeah, that was one horrible
Adeola:why do you blame yourself?
Samee:I shouldn't have said no to that property, but even if there's leaks, even if it was coming down, even if there was mould. I don't know how to explain this, but I think being homeless is worse than, you know, living in a, I don't know, living in a dumpster, is better.
Adeola:I think in hindsight you say this, but you don't know, you don't know what the situation could have been. If you had taken that property, you don't know if your wife one of your kids, or you could have got ill you know, depending on how bad the mould was, you just don't know.
Samee:Yes. So also I was told that once you get this property, basically you stay in there and if there's leaks and mould. My concern was health issues for my wife. She's got severe ashma that I cannot explain what she goes through but you know what, it's better than being homeless.
Adeola:Theres, this. Act called fit for human habitation act. and it lists different things on it, which goes against the fit for human habitation And I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know, but I'm sure that if you're with a council or a housing association, you could actually get a solicitor and, do a disrepair case, if you don't feel like, the property isnt fit for you, but it lists different things. And one of the things that's on there is mould,
Samee:right I mean, this sounds really good on the paper.
Adeola:All I'm trying to say is you don't know how it would have been. If you had taken that property,
Samee:Yes, but the point I'm trying to make is all these acts are really good when reality to implement them. It's not that easy. Like last week there was another housing association in Croydon. it was in the news. So you can literally Google it and see the pictures of the leaks and mould in the property. And I'm like, really, like, there's such a big leak that the lady is per a tub in there and it fills up every hour. They're like, it is what it is.
Adeola:It's just disgusting it makes me sad that we live in a world where we think it's okay for other human beings to live like that.
Samee:Yeah. Yeah.
Adeola:Where did you go from there?
Samee:This is where you come in because whilst I was homeless that night. I spent in police station the very next day, I had an interview. For a job in a housing association where I went for the interview. And you were sitting in the room. There was three people you were, there is couple of other staff members. And then yeah, you picked me up.
Adeola:Well, no, we just gave you the job.
Samee:Yeah. You, you guys gave me the job and that saved my life because once I started working for that housing association and they started paying my wages, which pretty good wages. I went back to private property. I even though, I had to sacrifice a lot of my, you know, like my, I stopped drinking coffee just to save money, this and that, whatever
Adeola:You, you entered the world where you were sacrificing things, which I call first world issues,
Samee:yeah, yeah, So basically we cut off alot of our for groceries just to make sure we keep on paying rent. So we stopped buying stuff, food for ourselves, one you on tuna can for each person, adults me and my wife and use to survive like that we stopped buying meat, beef, whatever, cut off everything. Because my wages were going for private rent did you know about things like, food banks? No, I'm too naive for that. I had no idea about food banks. I was buying everything with my own pocket, but that job help me to get back on the ladder of private rent. So that's where you come in and I can not thank you. And that housing association, everybody who made it possible for me get that job. So now, do you understand, you understand when I said to you, I cannot. Thank you. I can never thank you enough. It wasn't it wasn't us. We didn't get you the job. You got yourself the job. Yes. But, what you don't understand is that just because you saying yes to me, how it panned out in the next few years, like I'm sitting in a, in house now
Adeola:it's because of you. Don't really get that it's because of you, it, you turned up to that interview. You did I'd say an average job of it was you.
Samee:Yes. But when I was given, I still remember, you asked me, you asked me. If I'm given an option of choosing, like, this is the wage income band, and then this is this, which option would you take? I said the highest wages that you were offering at that time. Yes. And if let's say you were to say he, he's not going to get where he's asked for that I would never be able to go on that ladder off private property rent, but market, I would never be able to do that. So thanks to you. You, you should take some credit.
Adeola:No, it was, it was actually all you. yeah, it was all you.
Samee:I'm not going to change my opinion. I think I, now I think you, you might be able to understand when I say I can never thank you, enough
Adeola:It's the first time I understand what you what you went through. But even then, I don't, I don't understand, but I, I can't imagine that. I can't imagine someone going through that.
Samee:I'm not in touch with this lady it's been years. she used to work for that housing association I was working for through a contractors and she used to work in facilities, team and name was. Mandy, that's her name, She was a facilities team member and she saw me carrying this bag around and she asked me that what's this bag with clothes in it? So I explained that I'm homeless, I'm on the streets. So when I'm coming to work, because I was was the key handler. So I explained that this bag is basically I'm homeless and she felt so sorry for me, that she basically applied for this job on my behalf. And this was supposed to be an internal job opportunity even though I was an outsider.
Adeola:She did something that you'll never forget. something so small for her that you'll never forget.
Samee:And, and she doesn't know like, she's, she, I don't think she knows what she's done for me. she did this and it's so funny that the week I joined that housing association is the week that she was leaving. So she's not in touch with me. And she doesn't know what she's done. Like because of this one action of hers, it's like a ripple effect that I came back into private rent property. My kids had a roof on their head, and then things panned out in a way. she's gone with her life. She doesn't know, but I pray for her
Adeola:Where are you in your life now? Are you in a good place? do you feel that experiance has made you partly the person that you are today, like you're still growing, you know, each experiences it's a lesson.
Samee:Yeah. So what I would say is I'm so thankful that I went through that experience. It's given me a renewed energy and motivation keep on going for my kids every day I wake up, I go to work. I'm so grateful for my job. I'm so grateful for what I have now is that I want to keep it. I would never ever go back to that place that I was in five years ago and watching my kids on the streets being homeless, I know it's a bad experience, but I think the positive out of this is that it's made me such a better human being. It's helped me grow up and it's a motivation. That I would do anything now to make sure that I'm never homeless again. Even if that means I have to move mountains, I am going to do it for my kids for my family, I'm very grateful, ive got the experiance I'm not complaining it's life. You know, these things happen and you've got, you have to learn.
Adeola:You are a good person, I'm glad you're happy. And I'm glad that you're still aiming higher.
Samee:Thank you. And I'm going to ask you to give yourself some credit. You need to give yourself a lot of credit.
Adeola:Samee One last thing what would you say to people about their perception of immigrants who come over to this country
Samee:Immigrants bring a lot of skill with them. open your mind and hearts accept them be nice to them. They're not going to say anything to you then they're not here to harm you. I think you should welcome them. Be nice to them we all can be decent human beings to each other.
Adeola:Thanks
Samee:yeah, you're welcome.
Adeola:Thank you for listening to the first episode of ChatAholic please, please, please subscribe. My next episode called premie and the pandemic will be available soon. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Have a lovely evening or morning. Or afternoon. Thanks