This episode I spoke to Felicia Heath, the author of Spirit of a Hummingbird: memories from a childhood on the run.
From a turbulent childhood she kindly spoke openly & honestly about the reason she choose to share her story with the world. Her aim is to help others know that they are not alone.
Her story is one that focus's on strength and the struggles of 1st and 2nd generation immigrants.
https://www.mixedfeelingsmama.com
https://www.instagram.com/latinforhappiness_md/?hl=en
Please note transcription accuracy may vary.
Music by - Neffex - don't want to let myself down
Neffex - A year go
This episode I spoke to Felicia Heath, the author of Spirit of a Hummingbird: memories from a childhood on the run.
From a turbulent childhood she kindly spoke openly & honestly about the reason she choose to share her story with the world. Her aim is to help others know that they are not alone.
Her story is one that focus's on strength and the struggles of 1st and 2nd generation immigrants.
https://www.mixedfeelingsmama.com
https://www.instagram.com/latinforhappiness_md/?hl=en
Please note transcription accuracy may vary.
Music by - Neffex - don't want to let myself down
Neffex - A year go
Welcome to another episode of ChatAholic. This episode I speak to Felicia Heath, I'm just really grateful that I got to speak to her. So I really hope that listening to her story and her journey encourages everyone to read her book because wow, the strength that it must have taken for her to write the book, which is a memoir. It's nonfictional. I really enjoy talking to her. I hope you enjoy the episode. Would you mind telling me a bit about you, where you are from and anything that you are happy sharing?
Felicia Heath:Sure. I'm Felicia Heath. I am originally from Massachusetts. I am Vietnamese and Chinese. My parents were both immigrants, so I'm a first generation immigrant. I'm also a critical care anesthesiologist. I'm currently practicing in Pennsylvania, and I am married to a physician and I have four young kids. I also am a debut author of Spirit of a Hummingbird Memories from a Childhood on the Run that was released this past September of 2022. And I'm also a mommy blogger of Mixed Feelings mama.com.
AO:I had a look at your blog and I really love it. you are so open and you just invite people to know what you are feeling, what you've been doing. So on a complete side note, I do love your blog. Think it's great
Felicia Heath:Oh, thank you so much.
AO:And as I said to you when I emailed you, your children are so, so cute. They're so cute.
Felicia Heath:Thank you.
AO:One of the questions I wanted to ask you, you have many roles you're juggling so many plates. how do you manage that? Because I know you have your husband and your partnership, but it's still a lot. So how do you manage that?
Felicia Heath:right? It is a lot because. Aside from just practicing, I also have leadership roles in the hospital system. And I'm trying to launch this book and, reach as many people as I can through podcasts and book signings, and still blog, I think. I am okay with accepting a lot of help in order to do these kind of things that give me fulfillment. So I essentially have no problem asking for help. My kids all go to daycare in the morning. I have an O pair that lives with us. I have a babysitter on the weekends. I have an extremely supportive husband, and you know, I'm in a position where I'm lucky enough to have. Help in the sense that I hired a cleaning service. I get my groceries delivered so I don't waste time at the store or parking or driving. And I do all of these things in order to support these other roles because I think they're important for me and my purpose and my family. And then I also make sure that I create time for me to have energy to continue doing this. So I make sure I work out for 20 minutes. I meditate for a few minutes during the day, and that's what keeps me going.
AO:Okay. I like that you are unapologetic about the fact that, do you know what? I do have help. And actually that's okay. And the reason I say this is because I know moms and some of my mum friends. I don't know. It's almost as if they feel like, no, like I am not going to ask for help. I'm going to just keep on struggling and doing it myself. And actually, not in a horrible way, but you don't get an award for struggling. So if you can get help, yes, you should take the help. And I like that you, I like that you've said that.
Felicia Heath:Yeah, and I think we. Put a lot of pressure on ourselves to do everything, but this is a different time that we live in. Women are not only mothers anymore, they juggle a lot of other stuff, and they also have to keep their cup full so they can continue to give to others, including their children. So I don't shy away with it. I'm very open about it, and I hope that there's quote on quote no, you know, guilt around this,
AO:there's nothing wrong with it. And I personally, my attitude to most things is no one's entitled to guilt someone into doing something a different way or shaming them because actually different things work for different people, and in my opinion, No one's entitled to criticize that,
Felicia Heath:I totally agree, and every family is different. Every dynamic is different. The situations are different, and you just have to find what works for you.
AO:thank you for just being so honest and open about that. Right. I'm going to move on to your book. So, I need to say, just for people listening, that your book is an autobiography. It's not fiction. It is actually your memoir, which is why the title is Spirit of a Hummingbird, memoirs of a Childhood on the Run, because it is based on your memories. What made you decide, okay, do you know what? This is something I need to do. I need to put this down and actually share my story with others. What led to that decision?
Felicia Heath:Initially it was when I started to realize that there was power in it. For a long time, I didn't talk about my story. I was very vague about my family. And when people asked me, I gave very close-ended answers. Later in life when I became more comfortable with who I was and what I came from, I start to share a little bit at a time with a colleague or a friend and you know, ultimately my husband. And the more I told my story, the more I realized that there was strength in it. And. others encouraged me to continue to tell my story, so that's when the initial idea came to mind and I became more comfortable with letting people, those around me know who I was. Then when I started actually writing, it was very cathartic. It was therapy, so I had to keep doing it, and I healed during that writing process. So that was another reason. And then once I finished the book and I had kids, it was important for me that my children understood their mom and their grandmother and their grandfather in this light as well.
AO:why was that important for you? For your children to know, for your children to see that side of the females in their life. Why was that important for you?
Felicia Heath:Well, one, I have three daughters and a son, and I want them to see, The strength in women. I want them to my daughters to believe in themselves. I want my son to make space for women. And those things were very important. The other reason is in just two generations, I didn't go through half as much as what my parents went through, and my kids are really not gonna go through a fraction of what me and my husband went through, and they are not. Going to have a lot of struggles that we had to deal with because my husband and I have created a family and a future for them. So I think it's important that they know that there's some grit and some resilience like in their blood. So for me, that story's important for them to have for the rest of their lives, and hopefully they will find lessons in it that they can continue to pass on.
AO:I do understand that. I've spoken to people who have written autobiographic books before and they said something similar to what you said in that they felt some shame I never really understood it because I think the first person who told me I didn't understand because I thought, why would you feel shame in something that wasn't your fault? So I'm going to ask you, why did you feel shame?
Felicia Heath:I think when you go through the book, there were a lot of incidences of trauma that I was not even okay with just yet, let alone sharing it. So that was part of it. The other reason was the field I was in, I was in medicine. I am very untraditional in the sense that I made it here on my own. I was the first person in my family to get an advanced degree to be an example for my little sister and brother. But a lot of the people that I was surrounded with, you know, came from parents that were doctors and lawyers and had it set up that way. And I felt, I don't know if I felt just like an outlier or I would be judged for Where I came from and how I got there, and a lot of it was I had not come to accept who I was just yet. I didn't have that comfort of what I see now after I was able to reflect in a more meaningful way.
AO:When did that period of reflection come for you? at what stage did you start to feel. Just comfortable in your skin and in who you
Felicia Heath:it's hard to pinpoint. It's, it was a gradual. Evolution. I would say that probably started, let's say in my mid twenties was probably when the cycle started and the transformation when I was a little bit more mature when I stepped out of my comfort zone and then realized I was still doing well. I had some self-validation, uh, my Insecurities. Kind of went away. I had a reliable track to, I would like to believe success. And I think that's kind of when I started getting very comfortable with my skin. And then when I shared my story with my husband on a really intimate level, he also gave me the feedback that I needed to hear. I think in order to share my story and feel empowered by it.
AO:Are you at a stage now where I think I know the answer to this, but I'm just going to ask you do feel, you do feel empowered now, don't you? Because when I look at your blog, I see someone who appears to be just very comfortable with who they are.
Felicia Heath:I am very comfortable with who I am now. I really am, I don't have any qualms about how I do things and I'm very open and honest, like you said about the areas that I do struggle with or have mixed feelings about. Cuz it's complicated, but I have no issue talking about it, putting my feelings out there. Cause I don't think I'm the only one. And I hope. it can open up some conversation and help people relate if I'm a little bit more open about my own ideas and how I'm doing things. But I'm very, I'm very confident in who I am now.
AO:I think that's amazing because you've been on such a journey for you to be where you are now in itself is remarkable and also, Just saying not everyone, even people who haven't gone down the path that and had all the experiences that you've had, not everyone manages to get there. That's a credit to you. I also suspect, and correct me if I'm wrong, I think it's also a credit to your mom.
Felicia Heath:Oh, absolutely, 100%, if not all of the credit goes to my mom.
AO:No, not all of it. I can't give it all to her.
Felicia Heath:almost all of it though, she's resilient and she's always been there for me and she has believed in me she's always tried to look at the every situation from an optimistic light and her resilience and her strength. That's all characteristics that I gained from my mother.
AO:What was her reaction when you told her about writing your family's story?
Felicia Heath:She always knew I wanted to write. When it first came up, she was open to it. I actually interviewed my mother and learned so much about her in that interview for the book and. I think everyone feels a little bit vulnerable when you say, I'm gonna expose your story to the world, anyone that's involved in the book. Right. So I think there was a sense of vulnerability and she didn't wanna read the book before she, it was published. She wanted to let me go through my creative process and she's, she supported it and she read it and she was okay with it.
AO:I just love to ask people who do fit into what is called a minority group. What was that like for you? what message do you pass over to your children? Because I know that they're of mixed heritage as well. But I know growing up in the nineties in where I live in the United Kingdom, it, it wasn't easy. And I know it wasn't easy for you. would you mind delving into that a little bit?
Felicia Heath:Oh yes. I think being an Asian American woman, there are. So many stereotypes surrounding, each type of minority, but specifically as an Asian American woman, you know, I have the stereotype is that I'm quiet, I'm submissive, I'm timid, obedient and I balance breaking down those barriers without, and this is difficult to explain without making anyone uncomfortable. So it depends on the time and place. just, work on being more assertive and because it's a great question, and it's something I probably haven't really reflected on enough, but it happens daily. I went through the racism as a kid and that was. More prominent, you know, in the eighties and the nineties and the Vietnam War was going on and there were a lot of immigration from Asia into the United States. There was the Chinese, abolition act. All of that made it very difficult, especially on my mother and then me witnessing her go through some racist events. And then there's a part in the book where I am enrolling into grade school and the principal is asking if I need to take English as a second language. And my mom says Absolutely not. Her English is excellent. She knows how to read, she knows how to write. I pass their aptitude test and he. essentially still enrolls me in English as a second language, and those undertones, you know, have stayed with me for, it's a lifetime. But I do think it's important that every day, every kind of implicit bias, I'm working to break down in a tactful way. because I don't want my kids to live under the shadow of stereotypes and it's unavoidable, right? This is a deep seated historical issue that I am not gonna solve in my lifetime but I can. Continue to work on it so that my kids, their kids, their kids kids will have a better future. I don't know if that answers your question.
AO:I'm always interested to speak to someone who is a minority who lives in a different country, because actually I don't believe there, there isn't an answer. I guess we have learned that we don't actually have to just be submissive to any remarks or. The way people treat us,
Felicia Heath:Mm-hmm.
AO:but we have, far to go. We're, we are just not, we are not there yet. We got better. I keep being told, but we are not there yet. So I feel like we just have to,
Felicia Heath:Continue to do our work because we, I, you know, it's, it's hard to say if we'll ever get there, but if we just have to continue to do the work, You know, I do this at our daycare a lot, and I don't mean to go off on a tangent,
AO:No, no, no. Feel free. Feel free.
Felicia Heath:but when I live in a predominantly white area, and my kids go to a school or a daycare that's predominantly white. So initially when we are enrolled there I was very frustrated about some of the things, like they didn't celebrate and. One example being like, so they had, daycare was open for Martin Luther King Day, and I know, they had celebrated all these other holidays and for some reason there was no activity planned for that day. And I mean, mind you, my kid was like one but I was very upset about this. I was like, this is a US holiday, you know, it's important for me, even if my kid was three months. It's important for Me that they get exposure as there as possible. We don't know what's happening in that growing brain. What kind of synapses are being connected. It has to happen straight out of the womb.
AO:I'm really surprised. I just thought in America, Martin Luther King Day it's a big deal. I know the Canadians celebrate it, so I'm just very, I understand. I'm in the United Kingdom. Yes, fine. Technically, it's not really part of our history. I get that, but it, I'm really surprised. I'm actually really surprised.
Felicia Heath:Yeah, and I was surprised too. I mean, his impact was universal. It's not just the United States. So I was very surprised and you know, I had to do a lot of stuff to kinda nudge them in the right direction. So after that, I started. Bringing books during Latin Heritage Month and giving them activities for Asian American Pacific Islander Month and asking probing, because that's what it takes sometimes. And is it annoying? Yes. But if I don't do it, then it's not gonna happen. And then, you know, two, three years later now I walk into the building and. there's Women's History Month, there was Black History Month that was celebrated and they had an activity every single week. And I'm not saying I'm that person that pushed that school to do that, but whoever was it along with me, that's the kind of thing, like you kind of have to continue to remind people to do these things, especially in a predominantly white community because those are the kids that don't have the exposure to the minorities and the diversity, right? So it's even more important in that community, in my opinion. that's how I'm trying to push it a little further along. And I am seeing a difference. And I don't think it's just me, but maybe there were other parents that appreciated it or, they were more open to it after I bring it up and continue to bring up, bring it up, but I can't stop. is the moral of the story
AO:I am the worst because I don't believe you should stop, because the young people now at some point are going to be part of the next generation, so they have to know what came before them. From an early age, surely it's not just for, you know, the minority children.
Felicia Heath:And the other thing is like it's, I don't want to do it. It's a pain in my butt after a long day. I put together this Chinese New Year thing for them, like a whole thing with like envelopes and money and explaining like the tradition because it's a huge deal. It's a big, big global celebration and. I don't wanna do that when I get home after a long day. Taking care of the kids, putting them to bed. You think I wanna sit there for an hour and put these things, but I do it. I do it cuz it's important.
AO:I get that it's a lot of work for you, but do you know what You are, right? It is important. And maybe if things like this were done years ago, maybe we'd be in a slightly different world now. I don't know, but ignorance isn't bliss.
Felicia Heath:Mm-hmm.
AO:that's just not true. Ignorance is never bliss.
Felicia Heath:I totally agree.
AO:I'm told, I'm unrealistic, but I don't care if people think I'm I want at some point to know that there will be a world where people are just more accepting and kinder to one.
Felicia Heath:Mm-hmm.
AO:And that's how I live my life. So yes.
Felicia Heath:I love that. I absolutely agree. And the people that don't think you're realistic, I mean, you have to just keep doing what you're doing. Despite what people say, because it is really, really important and relevant every day.
AO:No it is. Thank you. Right. I wasn't sure whether I should ask you about this. I wondered, please don't go into too much detail and give spoilers, but would you tell me a little bit about your dad, what your happy sharing, but not too much to give away the content of the book.
Felicia Heath:I will give you just about enough you know the amount that's on the back of the book, I guess. So he. was the Vietnamese immigrant, he's ethnically Chinese. He came to the United States in, I think the late 1970s and then, you know, as a survival tactic, went into organized crime. and then the whole. Book is based on a period of time, largely a period of time where he gets sentenced to prison. He escapes prison, and then we go on the run as a family.
AO:Okay. And when I, just for people listening, when I said you've been through such a journey that was part of your journey. you were a child having to live through that. have you got to a place of, I don't really know what the word is. I feel like I want to use forgiveness, but I don't know if that's the right word. you can just correct me, but forgiveness towards him for what you all went through.
Felicia Heath:I have. I forgive him, and for a long time I held onto this idea that I needed a father daughter relationship. That's the norm. That's what we hoped to have. I kept on holding onto that idea, but really it wasn't how I felt. It was an authentic. It wasn't our relationship, and I've gotten to a place where I look at it for what it is and what I've gained from him, what I've gained from our past together, and I've forgiven him. And I no longer hold onto this idea of a father daughter relationship, a traditional one, and I'm very, at peace with. How things are, how things were. so I think forgiveness is an accurate term.
AO:when I said to you, how did you get to this stage where you were comfortable in your skin? Was it the same as getting to the same place in terms of your dad was, it wasn't an overnight journey.
Felicia Heath:No, it was not an overnight journey. I initially, when that relationship had the opportunity to rekindle, I did try. So for that was part of. The transformation, I would say of, or the beginning part of how I got to forgiveness or being at peace with our relationship. Initially, when we had the chance to rekindle it, I tried and you know, I just didn't feel right, and I kept pushing it and pushing it, and then I let it happen, but it never felt right. It never felt natural. It felt like way too much effort. and sometimes it felt negative when the thought of it should have been positive. And when I started to realize that and that it didn't really bring me much happiness, I started to think that, you know, maybe I'm okay with letting it go. And then I did, and then I wrote the book, and the book gave me a lot of insight, and I came to a point where I was, okay, we grew apart, we are not relevant in each other's lives anymore. At some point he was, but now, you know, I'm an adult I have my own family, I have my own thing going, and no thanks to him. So I don't know why I would need to reintroduce that into my life, And. I'm at peace with it. I'm almost can appreciate our relationship. I've even taken some positive perspective on it. that's kind of where I'm at. I'm totally fine with it now, and it did take me a while, but I'm here
AO:what positive perspective have you got from it?
Felicia Heath:Yeah, there's, there's a couple things that come to mind. So for a long time I was maybe angry or I didn't understand, like, why did he have to be a criminal? Why did he have to be like a mafia boss out of all things? And when I wrote the book and I delved into. The struggles of an immigrant. I was like, it's not easy, you come here, you don't speak English, you have nothing. You are poor. Your family's poor. You have no opportunity. The current social climate is, you know, the Vietnam War, the residual effects was still happening. People felt very strongly about that, and you're just trying to survive. The fastest way to survive is not going to college. sometimes it, it meant doing things like what he did and he happened to go down that path, but it was all a survival tactic under the conditions he was given. And I can, I guess I can appreciate that more. That's one, two. He had this sense of confidence that I do think I gained from him. And he did always, you know, put some things in my head that I've taken away forever. Like he would say, Felicia, you are beautiful. You are gonna be the next Miss Chinatown. he always told me that. and I've taken it with me and this, and now like looking back like 20 years later when social media is like a huge thing and people have self-esteem issues. I look back and I'm like, Hmm, I don't really have those issues. I am confident and I wonder if that's where I got it from. Like he instill it into me. and to me so hard that I don't have any issues with, like the social media and myself image. and, what he did put our family through. I'm not sure if I didn't have that, those challenges and that grit that I would be where I was. I think that. I'm more driven because of it, and now I have a story to tell thanks to him and I have more of a purpose on a bigger picture, all because of what he put us through, if that makes sense.
AO:No, it does and I love the, and I'm by no means am I saying the path he chose was the correct path. But I love that you can acknowledge why he chose that path. because I think you're right. it was hard for them. And I spoke to someone the other day and I was asking him questions about the Vietnam war, and he was saying to me that America actually had quite a high percentage of. Vietnamese immigrants. I was not aware of that. And he said to me, and now you've got the first generation, the second generation, he said, and they're future leaders and they're doing so well, and you are actually a very good example of that. But to understand him, I don't know if he needs understanding, but at least to understand why he chose the path he did. there was a lot going on in that time, and actually it wasn't easy going to any country as an immigrant.
Felicia Heath:Mm-hmm.
AO:And I love that you, I really liked, that response. I like, that's basically the place that you've got to where you've been able to look at the big picture and. Basically say, okay, I get that. And actually, even though you know, there's no relationship, really, I'm at peace with that.
Felicia Heath:Mm-hmm.
AO:You're very level-headed and balanced. So I know, or at least I think you are quite big on spirituality and you mentioned earlier about meditating and you said you have something in your house. You do with not your son, cuz he's too young, but you do with the girls and it started with your eldest and you have this affirmation and I just wondered if you just tell people what their affirmation was because I love it. So I wanted you to just, I just wanted to hear it.
Felicia Heath:Ah, so the affirmation is, I'm strong. I'm fearless, and depending if it's the girl or the boy or the girls, I'm smart and beautiful, or I'm smart and handsome and nothing in this world can stop me.
AO:I love it, but I just love, I love affirmations. I love meditation, and I love installing in young people that, you know, within reason. Don't ever let anyone say to you You're not good enough, or you can't do something because actually you can. I love that you do that. Why is that so important for you? Why did you want to do that with the children?
Felicia Heath:For a couple of reasons. So I referred this earlier. I realized the word of affirmations that even my dad, who was, you know, not the best person instilled in me, carried on with me into my adult life. And the other reason is I can only do so much for my children before they get exposed to the world,
AO:right? Yep. Yep.
Felicia Heath:So while I, they're in my house and as much time that they spend here with me, I really have to build that foundation of. Unshakeable confidence that once they do step out into the world a little bit more and they get exposed, that foundation is there, that they know who they are and they are confident and strong and all of those things I said. And once they go into that wall, no one can tell them otherwise. They believe in it so hard that no one can tell them otherwise. So that's important. My husband and I both do it like to an extreme. We don't even allow the world can't in our house. Like if you wanna say shit, fine, but you can't say can't You can say I need help. You can say, I have to try again, but you can't say I cannot do something that is a bad word in our house,
AO:No, I love that because actually it's just not a good word because actually I keep saying this, but I love that you are installing that in them at such a young age because it does make a difference.
Felicia Heath:I hope so. I hope so.
AO:Could you just say where you can get your book from
Felicia Heath:Yep. Kindle is available and then the paper back. Amazon would be the best place to get the book, but it is a available, Barnes and Noble online, which is I the United States. Store. So internationally, I think Amazon is probably the best. If it ships out there,
AO:you can get it on paperback from Amazon. you can. So it is available
Felicia Heath:It is available on my blog as well. Mixed Feelings mama.com and I will ship it directly to you if there is any issue internationally.
AO:Oh wow. Oh wow.
Felicia Heath:if you order it from my blog, there's an option to order it from my blog website too.
AO:Okay. If you order it. there's a reason I'm asking this, so is it better to order it from Amazon or is it better to order it from your blog? The reason I ask this is because I'm all about so bad the. People should get what they're entitled to as opposed to it going to a massive company like Amazon. So if you get it from Amazon, does do all those proceeds come to you or do Amazon take some of the money? Sorry, Amazon.
Felicia Heath:Uh, if you're talking about, then it'd be better to order straight from my website. If that's what you're considering. But you know, I appreciate the support from all outlets and then the audiobook is coming out soon, so that'll be another option for the people that wanna hear the story. But you know, don't really sit down with a book.
AO:do you know when the audiobooks coming out?
Felicia Heath:So I finished my last edit last night. So ideally in the next month or so.
AO:Oh, perfect.
Felicia Heath:Mm-hmm.
AO:Once it comes out, where would people go to get that?
Felicia Heath:that will also be available on Amazon and then it will just download onto Audible or whatever app you used for audiobooks. Mm-hmm.
AO:Okay, perfect. Thank you.
Felicia Heath:Thank you.
AO:I know you are really busy and I am gonna, it's like I wanna let you go, but I don't wanna let you go at the same
Felicia Heath:I carved out time for this, so I'm in no rush
AO:there's just so much that you do. what does the rest of your day look like?
Felicia Heath:today.
AO:Yes.
Felicia Heath:Uh, so after this I will, Start getting ready for my next podcast interview, which is in person. so I will drive up to the studio, do the podcast, then I have a meeting with the audiobook production company to do the final steps. And then after that I I'm also the vice President of medical affairs at my hospital, so I have some meetings that I'll hop on remotely. And then, the kids will wake up from nap. Around that time I'll do all the motherly things, and duties. I'll put them down to bed, and then I'll start getting ready for tomorrow. So I will pre-op my patients, cuz I'll be in the operating room, doing anesthesia tomorrow, go through their charts, do their orders, and then just get ready for the next. Spend some time with my husband, hopefully. This morning. Even before this podcast, you know, I had already worked out. I had already stretched, I had already meditated, then taken, took the kids to school, came back, made my coffee, and then hopped on to here. So, The day has already started
AO:you make me feel unproductive. And when my best friend listens to this, she's gonna, why can't I do more? and I'm gonna have to convince her that it's okay. It doesn't mean you are failing. We are all just different
Felicia Heath:so exactly. Good. Different and. Don't compare. Nobody should be comparing themselves to me. I just hope I could maybe motivate someone or inspire someone, but no one should be comparing.
AO:but you are inspirational. That's why I asked if you would mind coming on so I could speak to you because. You are inspirational, and That's the positive. I don't believe there's enough inspirational people that we come across every day and, no, you are inspirational, so just keep being the person that you are.
Felicia Heath:Thank you so much and I appreciate. Me on and having this platform to talk so openly about these types of topics,
AO:Thank you. Thank you for being honest and thank you for just letting me ask what I wanted to ask because I know that I am, I'm quite chaotic. There's no real, there's no real structure when I do these podcasts, so thank you for just bearing with me.
Felicia Heath:Oh yeah, of course.
AO:Thank you so much for listening to another episode of Chataholic. Initially when I invited Felicia on, I just wanted to speak to her about her book and her childhood, I guess, and then when I was doing some research and I was just learning more, Who the person behind the book actually is Now, I couldn't help but find out more about her So please go on to Amazon or Barnes and Noble and or her website or her. Preferably her website It doesn't matter whereabouts in the world you are, or I hope she doesn't mind me saying this, get her book, which is called spirit of a Hummingbird Memoirs from a childhood, because I didn't really want to ask her too many questions about the book because I'm trying to not do that anymore. And actually just learn more about how she became the person she is today and actually what her childhood was like because her dad was a mafia boss. So that's it my little bit. But thank you so much for listening.